plasmasphere
Players
There are exceptions to every rule, except this one.
Posts: 22 
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Post by plasmasphere on Oct 15, 2014 13:46:39 GMT -7
Recently, a GM told me "damage reduction isn't something you can notice". This is preposterous. Should my arrow bounce, my sword not cut, my spell have no effect, then I notice that a change in the physical world has not taken place that should have. To say that DR functions in such away that it's effects are always hidden completely from all senses is dishonest ad hoc reasoning which can and WILL be used by players to the detriment of GMs and rightly so. To subsequently say that it's okay for GMs to do so, but not players is a double standard. Please make a ruling that makes sense and applies to everyone, NPCs and PCs alike. A die roll, a certain number of attacks, something, but to claim that events cannot be perceived or measured or discovered is absurd. The undetectable and nonexistent appear identical. |
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Post by shroudb on Oct 15, 2014 14:46:21 GMT -7
for starters, based on rules, a caster immediatly knows if someone has failed his saving throw vs one of his spells.
but i also agree that damage reduction should be visible.
also knowledge rolls can easily show that p.e. "fey creatures seem resistant to non-cold itron swords" and stuff like that. it's what knowledge is suppossed to do.
if it is houseruled to not apply, at least tell us?
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Zanos
Leadership Council
No
how did i get here i am not good with computer
Posts: 684
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Post by Zanos on Oct 17, 2014 15:21:18 GMT -7
Which GM was this? I always find the GMs hiding information from players for unfair reasons is disingenuous because the DM literally has access to all the information about every character at a click, so telling people that they can't notice damage reduction is rather absurd.
I'd also suggest you be more polite about such things. We will of course review any sort of complaints or criticisms, but the tone you took in this post is needlessly combative.
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Post by Gryphyx on Oct 17, 2014 15:32:55 GMT -7
Hi Plasma,
I'd agree that in almost all case's players should be made aware of DR that has happened. Typically you get something like (your attacks dont seem to do as much damage as you expected). Alternatively, knowledge checks could get you the info before the fact. That said, there 'could' be special cases where it wouldn't be obvious to the player but I can't think of any off the top of my head and it should be very rare.
Please pm me which GM it was and we'll have a conversation on the back end.
Aside from this specific issue, I would ask that you bring these things to our attention more constructively and with more understanding in your heart. Our DMs have a range of experience and everyone makes bad calls now and then. Let's do our best as a community to build each other up rather than turn things into battles. We'll all be better off for it.
Cheers,
Gryph
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plasmasphere
Players
There are exceptions to every rule, except this one.
Posts: 22
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Post by plasmasphere on Oct 18, 2014 15:24:07 GMT -7
Firstly, any combativeness or rudeness in my initial post was unintentional and a mistake. I apologize and that is never my intention. Secondly, from my point of view, I was simply making the best points from both an evidence and consequence based position. I'll do my best to be softer in the future, as I strive for clarity, not conceit.
Thirdly, that GM had seen his mistake, admitted he was wrong, and changed his mind long before anyone posted anything else in this thread, so really, credit should be given to his rapid intellectual honesty. Kudos to him.
Again, I'll do my best to pay more attention to tone and less to ruthlessly effective argumentation in the future.
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Zanos
Leadership Council
No
how did i get here i am not good with computer
Posts: 684
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Post by Zanos on Oct 19, 2014 8:44:55 GMT -7
Again, I'll do my best to pay more attention to tone and less to ruthlessly effective argumentation in the future. Maybe take some of that attention and direct it into some humble pie; none of the staff needed convincing this was the correct ruling, considering that it's in the rules themselves. Resolved, so locking this. |
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