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Post by aubanis on Aug 27, 2015 9:09:01 GMT -7
I noticed in the wiki section for "Earning GP" that you are trying to improve the ways non-crafters can make money. I noticed that this doesn't scale at all during higher levels, so the gap between non-crafters and crafters gets to be ridiculously wide. It's my opinion that crafters should always make more money than non-crafters for obvious reasons, however, I don't believe the gap should be so wide. I'll use my character's stats for instance: Profession (Solder) | Level | Wis | Ranks | Total | GP Gained | Weekly | Percentage of wealth | | 1 | 1 | 1 | 2 | 12 | 84 | 46.6% | | 2 | 1 | 2 | 3 | 13 | 91 | 9.1% | | 3 | 1 | 3 | 4 | 14 | 98 | 3.2% |
I'll be a 20th level Barbarian doing my profession (solder) work for a mere 22gp a day or 154gp a week at .01% of my expected wealth. My suggestion would be to multiply the GP gained by level. In doing do you would get the following trend: | Level | Wis | Ranks | Total | GP Gained | Weekly | Percentage of wealth | | 1 | 1 | 1 | 2 | 12 | 84 | 46.6% | | 2 | 1 | 2 | 3 | 26 | 182 | 18.2% | | 3 | 1 | 3 | 4 | 42 | 294 | 9.8% | | 4 | 1 | 4 | 5 | 60 | 420 | 7% | | 5 | 1 | 5 | 6 | 80 | 560 | 5.3% | | 6 | 1 | 6 | 7 | 102 | 711 | 4.4% | | 7 | 1 | 7 | 8 | 126 | 882 | 3.7% | | 8 | 1 | 8 | 9 | 152 | 1064 | 3.2% | | 9 | 1 | 9 | 10 | 180 | 1260 | 2.7% | | 10 | 1 | 10 | 11 | 210 | 1470 | 2.3% |
I think this linear path with downtime profit would work out well for those with no crafting skills. Crafters would still make significantly more money, but now a random NPC in Rook couldn't hire a 20th level warrior demi-god for his profession for a week for only 154gp  I only used the profession in this example, but this would work if you kept your current rules for the others and just multiplied the final GP amount by level. |
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Post by novasry on Aug 27, 2015 9:19:41 GMT -7
It's worth pointing out that even the best crafters in the game only hit about 500 GP a day in profit, which requires a LOT of investment of class features and feats. Most crafters only get 200GP profit with a valet familiar.
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Post by aubanis on Aug 27, 2015 9:47:13 GMT -7
The multiplication can be adjusted to make the linear growth slower to place the daily value under crafters. The table below is using a 3/4 of level multiplication. This doesn't bring it low enough for me if what you say is true. But again, knocking down the multiplication is the answer. At the moment, I'm not a fan of the current system because it doesn't scale at all. | Level | Wis | Ranks | GP Daily | GP Weekly | Percentage | | 1 | 1 | 1 | 9 | 63 | 35% | | 2 | 1 | 2 | 19.5 | 136.5 | 13.6% | | 3 | 1 | 3 | 29.25 | 204.75 | 6.8% | | 4 | 1 | 4 | 42 | 294 | 4.9% | | 5 | 1 | 5 | 56.25 | 393.75 | 3.7% | | 6 | 1 | 6 | 72 | 504 | 3.1% | | 7 | 1 | 7 | 89.25 | 624.75 | 2.6% | | 8 | 1 | 8 | 108 | 756 | 2.2% | | 9 | 1 | 9 | 128.25
| 897.75 | 1.9% | | 10 | 1 | 10 | 157.5 | 1102.5 | 1.7% | | 11 | 1 | 11 | 181.5 | 1270.5 | 1.5% | | 12 | 1 | 12 | 207 | 1449 | 1.3% | | 13 | 1 | 13 | 234 | 1638 | 1.1% | | 14 | 1 | 14 | 262.5 | 1837.5 | .9% | | 15 | 1 | 15 | 292.5 | 2047.5 | .8% | | 16 | 1 | 16 | 324 | 2268 | .7% | | 17 | 1 | 17 | 357 | 2499 | .6% | | 18 | 1 | 18 | 391.5 | 2740.5 | .5% | | 19 | 1 | 19 | 427.5 | 2992.5 | .4% | | 20 | 1 | 20 | 465 | 3255 | .3% |
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rocshaajenkins
Approvals
Actually, I'll just take my Fighter to go, thanks :D
Posts: 271 
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Post by rocshaajenkins on Aug 27, 2015 10:54:48 GMT -7
If you want to pursue this sort of thing, I feel that crafters should always have the better end of making money. They do have to set aside resources for such a thing. So I would say a linear upscaling percentage ending at around 100gp for a character that, at level 1, can take 10 for a 14, and at level 20, can take 10 for a 33 (full rank investment without Wisdom adding anything). Level
| Check Result
| Normal gp (per day)
| Multiplier
| Final gp (per day)
| | 1 | 14
| 14
| 1
| 14
| 2
| 15
| 15
| 1.1
| 16
| 3
| 16
| 16
| 1.2
| 19
| 4
| 17
| 17
| 1.3
| 23
| 5
| 18
| 18
| 1.4
| 25
| 6
| 19
| 19
| 1.5
| 28
| 7
| 20
| 20
| 1.6
| 32
| 8
| 21
| 21
| 1.7
| 35
| 9
| 22
| 22
| 1.8
| 40
| 10
| 23
| 23
| 1.9
| 44
| 11
| 24
| 24
| 2
| 48
| 12
| 25
| 25
| 2.11
| 53
| 13
| 26
| 26
| 2.22
| 58
| 14
| 27
| 27
| 2.33
| 63
| 15
| 28
| 28
| 2.44
| 68
| 16
| 29
| 29
| 2.55
| 74
| 17
| 30
| 30
| 2.66
| 80
| 18
| 31
| 31
| 2.77
| 86
| 19
| 32
| 32
| 2.88
| 92
| 20
| 33
| 33
| 3 (2.99)
| 99
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A complex system like this would still, in my opinion, just be too confusing and cluttered for players to really care to use. Plus, downtime buildings exist, which can earn you much greater profit than this by investing in capital. EDIT: I want to clarify my stance on this issue. I personally do not care whether or not a change to this effect goes through, since downtime buildings exist and work to a similar end. I simply offered my interpretation of what was initially suggested. |
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Zanos
Leadership Council
No
how did i get here i am not good with computer
Posts: 684
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Post by Zanos on Aug 27, 2015 16:55:04 GMT -7
Only mundane crafting actually scales with level, and the market for that is typically not very large. I would be very surprised if practical profits from it came anywhere close to theoretical projections.
Overlord is awesome, by the way.
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Geckilian
Leadership Council
Empires Mierely require time.
Posts: 1,026
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Post by Geckilian on Aug 27, 2015 17:24:52 GMT -7
It really is. Albedo best devil.
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Post by aubanis on Aug 28, 2015 15:11:50 GMT -7
I love you both already :')
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Post by Kaju Kaiju on Sept 21, 2015 16:05:27 GMT -7
While I agree that Albedo is best devil who could say no to this face?  |
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Post by spacemanspoof on Sept 22, 2015 18:36:13 GMT -7
Another thought along these lines: what about retraining? The rules say that retraining requires a trainer. Why shouldn't that trainer be a PC? I don't know what the demand for retraining actually is, but allowing PCs to train others with a reduced cost similar to crafting would provide non-crafters (and crafters too, for that matter) a level-scaled source of income and would create additional incentive for interaction among the player base.
Naturally, someone acting as a trainer would have to meet all the requirements of the ability being retrained, including access to an appropriate training facility, and spend the necessary downtime.
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Post by The Furious Familiar on Dec 19, 2015 22:14:09 GMT -7
Mundane crafting with feats can get out of hand fast in terms of flooding markets. That is a problem in even non-long term downtime games. Making 100-200+ weapons a day like a factory by your self. I think given the community and the rule of thumb higher level players can "buy" from other players at 80% (saw in a different post I could be wrong) then craters would easily hit a few thousand a week with a 30% profit on magical items bought.
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Post by spacemanspoof on Dec 20, 2015 8:27:41 GMT -7
Except that crafting has been house-ruled to cost 50% rather than 33%. And selling items to NPCs is still 50%, as normal. So your factory churning out 200 swords a day will only break even, or maybe generate a small profit if you use Goods (not counting the huge investment in buildings to generate those Goods in the first place). And since most weapons and armors are pretty cheap, there's not a lot of demand among the player base to craft them. Plus, that demand is mostly among low-level characters, so it doesn't scale up with level like magic crafting. Really, how often is someone gonna walk into your shop and ask for adamantine Hellknight plate? (Which, by the way, my char will be capable of crafting in one more level...  ) |
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